Scoreboard - Add Last Stone Draw (LSD) Columns to Standings/Draw View
complete
n
nolan.thiessen@curling.ca
Capture pre-game LSD stats (input by umps) and output them as 4th ("LSD Standings") and fifth ("LSD Cumulative") columns on the "Standings/Draw" tab.
After consulting with Brett, we came up with the following implementation:
- Add "Game LSD" field for each team on the Game capture screen. Ump will provide this information to results manager.
- Add "LSD Cumulative" field for each team on the Game capture screen. Ump will provide this information to results manager.
- Add an LSD Cumulative column to the standings, which shows the most recent game's LSD Cumulative for the team in the row.
- Add an LSD Standing column which just denotes a numbered rank of the LSD Cumulative for that team, lowest LSD Cumulative being #1, etc.
- Also a the Game LSD to the end scores table, right before the first end.
- Add a checkbox to events to enable LSD.
- Potentially integrate the entire LSD spreadsheet and logic into Curling I/O so Umps can use that instead of a spreadsheet. Very doable, but I think we need to be sure that Umps are OK logging into Curling I/O to enter this data instead of using a spreadsheet. Maybe something we can discuss / tackle in the off season?
n
nolan.thiessen@curling.ca
Dave, what is a good email to contact you, I would like to set up a video meeting with you and IKS (our video scoreboard and program supplier).
Thank, Brett Waldroff
Dave Rapin
nolan.thiessen@curling.ca: Hi Brett, just saw this. You can reach me at support@curling.io
Dave Rapin
complete
I have outlined the requirements and uploaded screenshots to the original post for review. This is now LIVE and will show up when the next event captures LSD information.
Dave Rapin
CCA Chief Umpire Brett, do you have a resonal / sane upper and lower limit to the values that can be entered into Game LSD and Cumulative LSD? E.g.min of 0.00, max of 99.99?
Dave Rapin
nolan.thiessen@curling.ca Brett and I spoke and this is what we came up with:
- Add "Game LSD" field for each team on the Game capture screen.
- Add "LSD Cumulative" field for each team on the Game capture screen.
- Add an LSD Cumulative column to the standings, which shows the most recent game's LSD Cumulative for the team in the row.
- Add an LSD Standing column which just denotes a numbered rank of the LSD Cumulative for that team, lowest LSD Cumulative being #1, etc.
- Also a the Game LSD to the end scores table, right before the first end.
- Add a checkbox to events to enable LSD.
Dave Rapin
I'm adding relevant documents. The last stone draw protocols document, and a link to a copy of the LSD spreadsheet from the 2022 scotties. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ealYHp4d6KOxoA-5LAwBMEgQu9vSHRszYNfICZjrbMc/edit?usp=sharing
B
Brian Cassidy
Dave Rapin Thanks. These are the rules that the on-ice officials must follow and the values get recorded in a spreadsheet like the one in this link (may be missing some tabs which may or may not be important to us).
Dave Rapin
Brian Cassidy: I have the capturing of LSD set up and live now (first must turn on LSD for the event). Now I just need to figure out how to produce the calculations that Nolan is asking for: LSD Standings, and LSD Cumulative. Does anyone have the formula to go from LSD values entered for each game to the "LSD Standings" and "LSD Cumulative" stats? I assume it's not as simple as adding them all up per team for cumulative, and ranking those cumulative values for standings?
B
Brian Cassidy
Dave Rapin I think you need more data than just the individual game values but I may be wrong. The expert is Brett Waldroff. I have never been involved with the calculations done in his spreadsheet.
Dave Rapin
Brian Cassidy I'd like your opinion on where this should be captured. Right now there's no screen, other than the game scoring itself, that captures side / game position data. There's also no "Umpire" type role in event managers. I'd like to avoid creating a whole new section just to capture these values, and instead just add them to the game scoring capture itself. I'm thinking down where the Time Remaining fields are located. See attached image.
B
Brian Cassidy
Dave Rapin Can we add Brian Jr to this conversation? I think that spot is best (beside time remaining). Each team has a pre-game LSD and that can be entered at any time during the game but it likely makes sense to add it at game end when entering time remaining. It will be tricky to get the LSD info from the on-ice officials but that's my (event chief statistician) problem not yours. LSD monitoring and calculations are completely outside the stats system and the chief statistician doesn't normally get involved except they have to get the final team ranking for entry into Curling I/O. This is also needed for playoff scenario reports. Adding LSD info to team standings won't be easy because you can't calculate that from the individual game LSD values. The LSD system is a complex spreadsheet developed by Brett Waldroff (curlingcanadachiefumpire@gmail.com). Ideally that spreadsheet should be a module inside of Curling I/O but that would be a big project. I was always disappointed that there was no integration between these two systems. LSD values are really important as they are also used for final team placement. I see that Nolan wants LSD info added to the team standings and that makes sense but since the LSD system is not integrated with Curling I/O, the chief statistician has extra work to track down the numbers and enter the info into Curling I/O -or- that could be an extra duty of the head official for the event because they are the ones managing the LSD spreadsheet. All doable but Curling Canada officials have to realize that there is a person(s) in the loop which can slow things down. Curling Canada should be made aware of the implications of the non-integration of the LSD system and Curling I/O. I don't want to open Pandora's box on this but it was just a matter of time before Curling Canada would be looking for more LSD info in the standard reports.
Dave Rapin
Brian Cassidy: OK thanks. That's where I'll add it, and get some initial LSD reporting happening. Then we can review and iterate as needed.
Dave Rapin
in progress
Dave Rapin
planned
Re-opening now that we've completed V2 migration.
Dave Rapin
Justin Perry this feature request needs more details. 1) How do you want to capture last stone draw? 2) Is this for every competition or is it turned on for just a subset? 3) Is it important enough to be displayed prominently on the standings screen (density of information to end-user)? 4) Can you provide a rough mockup of what this would look like for both capture (including which screen), and publication?
Justin Perry
nolan.thiessen@curling.ca: Can you supply the elaboration Dave is seeking?
n
nolan.thiessen@curling.ca
Dave Rapin: Effectively I'd like to be able to get the officials to enter the last stone draw each round and it show up within the "reports" instead of having the officials create a spreadsheet workbook and print a PDF that we embed into the page and have to update continuously. It's a factor in playoff seeding and can eliminate teams or push teams from the playoffs into tiebreakers, so it's a big item for the athletes, coaches and officials, particularly at the end of a round robin to know where they stand for this. Would it make sense to send an old workbook that we have completed for a prior Championship to look at? As it is effectively moving that functionality into Curling i/o so the inputs and viewing is on there?
n
nolan.thiessen@curling.ca
Justin Perry: Yes I did provide some feedback. Not sure if you could see my reply or not but I can forward to you if you wish.
Justin Perry
Dave Rapin: Just verifying that this LSD adjustment is still part of the v2 scoreboard dev this summer 2022?
Load More
→